Subject: Re Voltage Proposal Losing Strength (Raunio)(Lundquist). Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 052835 -0600 From: Roy BeaversTo: guru -------------------------------------------------- This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------FF84BE9A3C2420DBF999A52D Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------B2EFD7207D43584C1B78C40E" --------------B2EFD7207D43584C1B78C40E Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit .........Response from EMF-L........ Dr. Lundquist is suggesting that all electrical utilities in a given region must adopt the same transmission line configuration that will NOT ground to the "ground". If even one company refuses -- it can prevent the other companies, who are willing to take preventive measures (like the co-ops below), from doing so.........guru...... -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: Voltage Proposal Losing Strength (Raunio) Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 22:29:18 -0600 From: "Marjorie Lundquist" To: roy@emfguru.com Roy, for those interested in citing newspaper articles, this appeared on pages B5 & B6 of the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel for March 13, 2001. I was very interested to learn that Xcel was the company pushing this, because this is the former Northern States Power Company (following a merger with another firm). When I was going out on visits to farms with Dave Stetzer last year (April and May, 2000), he told me that the transmission lines in western Wisconsin belonging to Northern States Power Company were contributing to the stray voltage problem there, not only on farms, but in towns, too. Dave said that the company had been informed of the problem and their co-operation had been sought in solving it, but they refused to do anything. This has had broad repercussions, because there are rural electric co-operatives that want to take action, but because there are NSP (now Xcel) transmission lines in their service area, they could be in for trouble if they take action to upgrade their lines, but the transmission line in their service area isn't upgraded at the same time. You see, when electricity was confined to the wires provided to carry it, and did not flow on the ground, then each power system was independent of all the others. But when current from the neutral wire gets on the ground and flows there, and when this happens on more than one set of power lines in a given geographic area, then the ground is a shared part of the circuit for BOTH systems. This means current from one system that gets on the ground can then go into the OTHER system! So the systems are no longer separate and independent. The situation in western (and central) Wisconsin is that there are both transmission lines that carry large currents, and rural electric power companies, whose distribution lines carry comparatively small currents, in the same geographic region. I haven't verified this with any expert, but I imagine that current from the much smaller rural electric co-operative won't have much impact on the transmission line, if any gets on it from the ground; but current from the transmission line could have a large impact on the rural electric co-ooperative, if some migrated via the ground from the transmission line to the rural electric co-operative's lines. The fact that Xcel refuses to do anything about its transmission lines has meant that some rural electric co-operatives that are willing to upgrade their distribution lines--which would get rid of the stray voltage problem for their customers--are afraid to carryout the upgrade on their own lines, so long as the transmission line is still putting current in the ground in their service area, because their upgraded lines would draw ground current from the transmission line onto their system. So Xcel's refusal to co-operate by halting the flow of current onto the ground from their transmission lines is having an adverse effect not only on people near Xcel lines, but also on the farm customers of some of the rural electric co-operatives in whose service areas their lines are situated. It's very clear that Xcel just doesn't want to incur the cost of the upgrade. Very likely their managers also don't think it is really needed. They obviously want to stop the lawsuits, too. What I would like to see is the Office of the Wisconsin Attorney General file a lawsuit against Xcel, in much the same way as the Attorney General of Michigan has done with Consumers Energy. I picked up an interesting item of information earlier this week, while talking to an attorney who has fought (and won) stray voltage lawsuits. He told me that the two largest electric utilities in Michigan are Detroit Edison and Consumers Energy. Consumers Energy uses grounded Wye transmission lines, and and their customers have serious problems with stray voltage. Detroit Edison, he said, uses the Delta configuration for its transmission lines, and there are no stray voltage problems in its service area. This suggests that transmission lines with the Delta configuration are preferable, from the perspective of stray voltage problems, to transmission lines with the grounded Wye configuration. I am actively looking into this, to see how much evidence there is. (I have reason to think that quite a few electric power companies are also thinking along these lines.) The fact that this was in the budget bill for the state of Wisconsin tells us, I think, that our new governor, Scott McCallum, is basically a junior version of former Governor Thompson: ready to roll out the red carpet for business, and turn Wisconsin into a "third world country" where the residents are chronically sick and impoverished, while businesses and their owners and stockholders reap rich financial rewards! I was willing to give him a chance to show that he was an enlightened Republican, but now he has blown it. -- Marjorie Sign up for a free About Email account at http://About.com --------------B2EFD7207D43584C1B78C40E Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit .........Response from EMF-L........ Dr. Lundquist is suggesting that all electrical utilities in a given region
must adopt the same transmission line configuration that will NOT ground
to the "ground". If even one company refuses -- it can prevent the other
companies, who are willing to take preventive measures (like the co-ops
below), from doing so.........guru......-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: Voltage Proposal Losing Strength (Raunio) Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 22:29:18 -0600 From: "Marjorie Lundquist" <marjlundquist@about.com> To: roy@emfguru.com
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Milwaukee Journal Sentinel for March 13, 2001.I was very interested to learn that Xcel was the company pushing this, because this is the
former Northern States Power Company (following a merger with another firm). When I was
going out on visits to farms with Dave Stetzer last year (April and May, 2000), he told me that
the transmission lines in western Wisconsin belonging to Northern States Power Company
were contributing to the stray voltage problem there, not only on farms, but in towns, too.Dave said that the company had been informed of the problem and their co-operation had
been sought in solving it, but they refused to do anything. This has had broad repercussions,
because there are rural electric co-operatives that want to take action, but because there are
NSP (now Xcel) transmission lines in their service area, they could be in for trouble if they
take action to upgrade their lines, but the transmission line in their service area isn't upgraded
at the same time.You see, when electricity was confined to the wires provided to carry it, and did not flow on
the ground, then each power system was independent of all the others. But when current
from the neutral wire gets on the ground and flows there, and when this happens on more than
one set of power lines in a given geographic area, then the ground is a shared part of the
circuit for BOTH systems. This means current from one system that gets on the ground can
then go into the OTHER system! So the systems are no longer separate and independent.The situation in western (and central) Wisconsin is that there are both transmission lines that
carry large currents, and rural electric power companies, whose distribution lines carry
comparatively small currents, in the same geographic region. I haven't verified this with any
expert, but I imagine that current from the much smaller rural electric co-operative won't have
much impact on the transmission line, if any gets on it from the ground; but current from the
transmission line could have a large impact on the rural electric co-ooperative, if some
migrated via the ground from the transmission line to the rural electric co-operative's lines.The fact that Xcel refuses to do anything about its transmission lines has meant that some
rural electric co-operatives that are willing to upgrade their distribution lines--which would get
rid of the stray voltage problem for their customers--are afraid to carryout the upgrade on their
own lines, so long as the transmission line is still putting current in the ground in their service
area, because their upgraded lines would draw ground current from the transmission line onto
their system. So Xcel's refusal to co-operate by halting the flow of current onto the ground
from their transmission lines is having an adverse effect not only on people near Xcel lines, but
also on the farm customers of some of the rural electric co-operatives in whose service areas
their lines are situated.It's very clear that Xcel just doesn't want to incur the cost of the upgrade. Very likely their
managers also don't think it is really needed. They obviously want to stop the lawsuits, too.What I would like to see is the Office of the Wisconsin Attorney General file a lawsuit against
Xcel, in much the same way as the Attorney General of Michigan has done with Consumers
Energy.I picked up an interesting item of information earlier this week, while talking to an attorney
who has fought (and won) stray voltage lawsuits. He told me that the two largest electric
utilities in Michigan are Detroit Edison and Consumers Energy. Consumers Energy uses
grounded Wye transmission lines, and and their customers have serious problems with stray
voltage. Detroit Edison, he said, uses the Delta configuration for its transmission lines, and
there are no stray voltage problems in its service area.This suggests that transmission lines with the Delta configuration are preferable, from the
perspective of stray voltage problems, to transmission lines with the grounded Wye
configuration. I am actively looking into this, to see how much evidence there is. (I have
reason to think that quite a few electric power companies are also thinking along these lines.)The fact that this was in the budget bill for the state of Wisconsin tells us, I think, that our
new governor, Scott McCallum, is basically a junior version of former Governor Thompson:
ready to roll out the red carpet for business, and turn Wisconsin into a "third world country"
where the residents are chronically sick and impoverished, while businesses and their owners
and stockholders reap rich financial rewards! I was willing to give him a chance to show that
he was an enlightened Republican, but now he has blown it. -- Marjorie
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